War on Christmas? Or something else?

[flewellyn]

Yet again, this year, we're hearing the right-wingnuts spouting off about how the "secular humanists" and the "liberal elite" are making war on Christmas by saying "Happy Holidays", as if this was some crime. Right wingers are adamant that somewhere, there are "secular humanists" and "ACLU types" who are trying to oppress Christians.

Ignoring the fact that it's hard to oppress a majority that controls most of the wealth and power, I have a message for those right-wing idiots who are still going on about "War on Christmas":

People, please.

We know that you conservatives like to speak in code words, but you're not fooling anyone. You haven't been fooling anyone for some time now.

We know full well that when you say "secular humanists" or "liberal intelligentsia" or "urban elite", you mean "Jews", okay? Give up the pretense already.

And while we're at it, stop saying "welfare mothers" or "illegal immigrants", and just say "blacks" and "Hispanics". We know you hate them too, so stop trying to be coy.

Comments

[cherrypep.livejournal.com]

Well, in fact I answer to the description of a secular humanist, and I say 'have a nice holiday' around this side of Christmas because half the people I work with are of religions other than Christian. Not that this dilutes your point of course; (1) these are ill-disguised code words, and (2) I don't live on the same continent ;-)

[lucretiasheart.livejournal.com]

'Specially since most welfare mothers are rural white women-- but, whatEVA!

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Oh, I read that a lot of polygamist Mormon families will have the wives (other than the legal one) register as single mothers to get welfare money for the family.

Meanwhile, the fathers decry welfare as communist.

[lucretiasheart.livejournal.com]

Hypocrisy is fun-- let's all try it! =P

*shakes head*

[randallsquared.livejournal.com]

So you're saying that you, unlike Flewellyn, believe that the right-wingers are (shock! horror!) actually against welfare like they say, rather than hating non-approved shades of skin? ;)

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Must they be mutually exclusive? I mean, they can still hate both non-whites AND hate the idea of not being allowed to hoard everything.

[randallsquared.livejournal.com]

Oh, of course! I'm not at all saying that they can't hold both. I thought you were suggesting that saying they held one belief was just a cover for some other belief they held *instead*. If they hold both, then there's no reason to think that one's a cover for the other... :)

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Never mind that both beliefs are quite contrary to actual Christian doctrine...

[lucretiasheart.livejournal.com]

No... If I thought they were against welfare, I would assume that rural white women would be the thrust of their intellectual diatribe.

Or-- maybe I just think they're all really ignorant and not even aware that most welfare money goes to rural white women. Hmmm... a'course, if they found that out, would they start to develop more "compassionate conservatism" and shift their opinion to say that they're against URBAN welfare, saying that there's no excuse when jobs are so plentiful in cities?? Gotta think like 'em to understand 'em.

*tries* ow.

[randallsquared.livejournal.com]

"If I thought they were against welfare, I would assume that rural white women would be the thrust of their intellectual diatribe."

In the context of Flew's original statement, that's... priceless. :)

[sheistheweather]

I'm Pagan. They blame all kinds of things on us. :p

[moronqueen.livejournal.com]

Second that one...it's not just Jews they're against...there's a lot of hate against Muslims, Pagans, Christians who aren't "Christian enough"...I work with way too many right wing nuts.

Bah humbug.

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

I only blame you for not answering your phone. :-P

[sheistheweather]

I'm sorry! My girlfriend was over last night. Forgive me? ;_;

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

That depends...did you take pictures? :-)

[sheistheweather]

Well, if you want pictures of girls snuggling fully-clothed while watching Gilmore Girls...

...then that's too bad because I didn't take any. >:D

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

That's okay, I was kidding (mostly).

*ring ring*

[allthelivesofme.livejournal.com]

Ignoring the fact that it's hard to oppress a majority that controls most of the wealth and power

You're not supposed to point that out, silly! They're the persecuted minority, remember? Umm, well, except when they're ranting against Hollywood. Then they're the 'silent majority' who should be catered to or else the power of their boycotts will shut down the entertainment industry. Or except when talk turns to ordaining gays, lesbians, or women in some churches, because we 'all' know that's not what God wants. Or except--

Heck, you get the idea. ;-)

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Oh yes. I used to point out to earnest young conservative Christian freshmen at my college (a Lutheran school) that, while there are indeed Christians in the world who do face oppression, they don't live in the United States. They sometimes had a hard time understanding that "not doing what I want" is not the same as "stopping me from practicing my faith".

[epa-flip.livejournal.com]

Did you go to Concordia at Moorhead? Just curious because that's where both my brothers went/are going. Me, I did the Gustavus thing. But, yes, Christians, not so oppressed in the US. Try China, but they've implemented the "Don't ask, don't tell, and we won't dissapear you" policy recently.

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Yes, as matter of fact, that was my school.

I've a friend who went to Gustavus Adolphus, though.

[epa-flip.livejournal.com]

Based on your birthdate, its entirely likely I was at GAC when your friend was (1997-2001). You probably just missed my brother though (I think he got done with school in 2003, but he didn't get there until 2001)

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

I took an extra year, because I had an extra major. So if he got there in 2001, I was there at the same time.

That doesn't mean I knew him, though.

[epa-flip.livejournal.com]

That's fair. While our colleges were small, they weren't THAT small. If you knew a tall Environmental Studies major who got tagged with the moniker "Sasquatch," you knew him, but seeing as he's a very social creature in the mainstream sense you and he may well have not been in overlapping social circles.

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Sasquatch, eh? Hmm...I take it he was large and hairy and bearded?

I don't recall seeing anybody else who looked like me around there...

[epa-flip.livejournal.com]

That he was. As opposed to me, who is short and hairy and bearded (and thus am generally referred to as a dwarf in the Tolkein sense).

[xuincherguixe.livejournal.com]

I just thought I'd mention again here that Stephen Colbert was the first person talking about the war on Christmas this year.

[parrhesia.livejournal.com]

Just to weigh in here a little, I don't think that most of the Christians that are complaining about a "War on Christmas" are specifically (or even partially) thinking about Jews.

I would divide the people complaining into two groups.

The first want be able to say "Merry Christmas" without having to think about if it's going to upset or offend anyone else - and yes, this is insensitive. Some are simply oblivious to that, though - "If date like Dec% then response.write("Merry Christmas")" Others are, paradoxically, trying to get up in your face with some Glad Tidings of Joy in order to somehow 'prove' this is a Christian country or something. But they are a minority of a group that is itself a minority.

The majority of the people are of the second type: they are themselves trying to be sensitive to other's feelings, or have been subject of criticism that's made them feel they better act like they are sensitive ;).

They're worried that expression of the fact that they are Christians and they're celebrating Christmas is being removed at the hands of a philosophy of "no one can have special rights (of talking, of displays, of activities), and we can't accommodate everyone, so no one will have any at all." It's the triumph of blandness over diversity.

Back to if this is all aimed at Jews - aside for a few of group one, I don't think it is at all. In fact, I think that many of the people complaining would think of people that are religiously Jewish as fellow 'sufferers' of this phenomenon (perceived or actual, as the case may be) of religion being removed from the public square. Most Christians are at least vaguely aware of the Hanukkah story, and quite a few know it pretty well - I learned about it in Sunday School, where it was taught as a factual miracle of God and another sign of His faithfulness. Most Christians are quite happy to say "Happy Hanukkah!"

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Well, among fundies, "secular humanist" has been a code word for "Jew" for a long, long time.

So the people in CHARGE of this whole "War on Christmas" thing, like Falwell and O'Reilly, I've no doubt are doing it for anti-Semitic reasons.

As for their followers...well, watch "Borat".

[thedilettante.livejournal.com]

Was't there a survey thingie that said Atheists were the most hated group in America?

Also, http://craptaculus.com/eac/

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Sure, but a lot of fundies think Jews are atheists.

"Well, they don't believe in JAAAAAYsus, so how can they believe in God?"

[anwyn18.livejournal.com]

I just hate the two-facedness of it all. All hell breaks loose if someone suggests Christian's can't put up nativities or whatever other things they like to do this time of year, but we can't say Happy Holidays? If they can say what they like, why can't we?

why not?

[lucretiasheart.livejournal.com]

I live in a small, Xtian town in rural southern Ohio-- when I gave money to a bell ringer and she said, "Merry Christmas," yesterday, I smiled back, quite sincerely, and answered back, "Happy Yule!" because I'm pagan. She smiled back, but the guy sitting on a bench near-by said, "Yule? YUUUEEL? Why can't the kids say Christmas anymore?" (both bell-ringer and bench sitter were elderly) I turned and answered him, "Firstly, I'm nearing 40. Secondly, I'm pagan, I celebrate Yule on the winter solstice, not Christmas." Then I grinned, "So, like Happy Holidays & Season's Greetings and stuff!"

Re: why not?

[flewellyn.livejournal.com]

Well, one fun thing is to say "Io saturnalia!"

Or "Cthulhu f'tagn!" That's always fun.

Re: why not?

[lucretiasheart.livejournal.com]

*CHOKING with laughter*

Them too! =D

Re: why not?

[anwyn18.livejournal.com]

See, I would be touched at that sincere a greeting. But then I am always touched when people offer blessing, whatever kind of blessing or good fortune they believe in. I'm not gonna turn ANY of that shit down!